Tank set-up, some questions!

So the tap water has about two and half times the concentration of free acid than your tank has (as a rough guide).

It is not possible at all to predict or even get a rough estimate of how much the pH would drop (or increase) by adding bog wood or peat to your tank.

There is no guarantee that the pH would drop or that the peat or bog wood would buffer the pH even if it did drop the pH.

It cannot be assumed that the pH will drop in your tank from pH8.2 to the pH of the water. There are quite a few things involved (I'll get you a link on this site that lists the reasons why a pH might be altered)

ian

Here's that link.

www.irishfishkeepers.com/index.php/forum...hange-simple-listing

Great link Ian, thanks!

The question remains though, is it a good idea to gtet some bogwood to see if that will lower the pH of my tank a little. I understand what you say that there's no guarantee that adding bogwood will lower the pH, it could do nothing or even raise it depending on lots of other factors. But so many sites and poster say it's a way to lower pH, so does that mean that on average bogwood does lower pH?

Thanks...

J.

On "average", if the original water contains little in the way of pH buffers, a proper piece of bogwood should lower the pH to some degree.

Even if it doesn't lower the pH, it is still going to give some organic acids or salts of them acids.

I personally do not look at what other sites or posters say on this as few of them are actually chemists or have the fish keeping experience (many are simply copy-n-pastes of out-of-date or incorrect info).

ian

Thanks Ian... Definitely agree about the copy and pastes, it's surprising how many times I've read the exact same text on different sites...

J.

Jasonb wrote:

Thanks Ian... Definitely agree about the copy and pastes, it's surprising how many times I've read the exact same text on different sites...

J.

If the info is correct, then there is no problem....but it is when it is incorrect and is being proliferated that problems start.

How can someone starting out know which is correct and which is not?
There are usually good hints within the text if the author doesn't know what they are on about....but one needs some experience to be able to spot that.

On the particular subject of this thread, the internet has been very good in proliferating out-of-date and incorrect information, and squashing out of the conversation the truer story with modern findings.

I often get called "old fashioned", by new keepers who use out-of-date Victorian knowledge and "facts", because I use the latest known information.

That is very odd indeed and baffles me totally.

ian

igmillichip wrote:

Jasonb wrote:

Thanks Ian... Definitely agree about the copy and pastes, it's surprising how many times I've read the exact same text on different sites...

J.

If the info is correct, then there is no problem....but it is when it is incorrect and is being proliferated that problems start.

How can someone starting out know which is correct and which is not?
There are usually good hints within the text if the author doesn't know what they are on about....but one needs some experience to be able to spot that.

On the particular subject of this thread, the internet has been very good in proliferating out-of-date and incorrect information, and squashing out of the conversation the truer story with modern findings.

I often get called "old fashioned", by new keepers who use out-of-date Victorian knowledge and "facts", because I use the latest known information.

That is very odd indeed and baffles me totally.

ian

curiously, I see something similar happen on American fish forums quite a lot. if anyone presents knowledge that is fairly new or even just is somewhat out of left field, it usually gets rejected with a statement along the lines of "Ooooh, I don't think I like the sound of that!"

LemonJelly wrote:

curiously, I see something similar happen on American fish forums quite a lot. if anyone presents knowledge that is fairly new or even just is somewhat out of left field, it usually gets rejected with a statement along the lines of "Ooooh, I don't think I like the sound of that!"

That's just human nature I think, most people don't like change. As I'm new to this I have to be open to new information, but even I struggled yesterday with the idea of adding wood or peat to my tank, as it wasn't in my original 'plan'!

J.

Jasonb wrote:

LemonJelly wrote:

curiously, I see something similar happen on American fish forums quite a lot. if anyone presents knowledge that is fairly new or even just is somewhat out of left field, it usually gets rejected with a statement along the lines of "Ooooh, I don't think I like the sound of that!"

That's just human nature I think, most people don't like change. As I'm new to this I have to be open to new information, but even I struggled yesterday with the idea of adding wood or peat to my tank, as it wasn't in my original 'plan'!

J.

But much of this is not actually about anything changing (in reality) at all.
If it were a change then things would be allowable somewhat.

It's a bit like either being told 10 years ago that humans die if travelling at over 30 mph......(something that was "fact" 200 odd years ago); or
being told that the Tooth Fairy is not quite as true as some would believe.

It is not the same as, say, the day we changed to having a smoking ban in the working place or the recent discovery of something new.

If it were a case of opinions, then all opinions are welcome.....but much of the stuff is not really about opinions (eg the best fish for a beginner is an opinion; the way that the nitrogen cycle works is not an opinion)

ian

I guess it's about changing people's minds, and if someone's mind is made up about a topic, no amount of science and truth will change it!

A small progess report for today. I'm removing any dead / dying leaves from the plants, the Vallis aren't doing great at all, but the Cryptos seem to be ok. And for the first time, my Nitrite test showed something (about .25) and Ammonia is a little lower, so hopefully that might be a start of Ammonia dropping and Nitrite increasing, time will tell!

J.