sand based aquarium

changing the aquarium this weekend and am getting a Vision 260....
I was thinking about getting a white sand instead of gravel..
anyone got any opinion( am sure u have... ) on pros and cons ?

white sand makes fish look washed out and colourless imho.Better to use river sand.This time of year you can get safe playsand from the early learning centre on mary st. for 5euros a bag.No salt in it or other yukkies.Looks the biz and is clear the moment you put it in. The Brand is called "zoom beach". Also make sure not to put too thick a layer on either....

thx Gav, will be into in a couple of weeks once the new tank settles

Def agree about the white sand,fell into that trap myself.The only thing really that saves my fish from looking washed out is the amount of dark stone and dark background!

Stay away from play sand.
Its filtht and is too lite.
You will wash more down the sink trying to clean it.

ok.. turned off sand...
so what about the coral gravel (white stuff) and what would it do to ph ?

ok.. turned off sand...
so what about the coral gravel (white stuff) and what would it do to ph ?

The sand from the pershops is good. Coral sand will raise the ph.
What fish do you intend to keep.

I'm using B&Q's own brand play sand in my discus tank. Works fine, it's easy to clean since no food leftovers or faeces will sink down into it. Glenview builders sand is fine to. There are a few pebbles in it but that's ok. I don't know how many places Glenview get their sand from but test for hardness builders first.

white sand makes fish look washed out and colourless imho.Better to use river sand.This time of year you can get safe playsand from the early learning centre on mary st. for 5euros a bag.No salt in it or other yukkies.Looks the biz and is clear the moment you put it in. The Brand is called "zoom beach". Also make sure not to put too thick a layer on either....

So what was that white sand I bought from you before Christmas Gav?
My ph is gone to about 8.0

Thats coral sand.

Not great for your Angels but super for Africans. Looks cool in the tank.

Angels naturally occur over white sand. Same as a lot of South Americans. You can use playsand unless you are planning on a serious amount of planting. Still possible but you will need to get a heater cable for the substrate and add a clay-based fert. A few swords will do fine without it

Try adding some blackwater extract (I make my own from alder cones) or filter through peat. You r water will get a bit of a yellow/brownish colouration and your fish's colours will show up better.

Holger

Angels naturally occur over white sand. Same as a lot of South Americans. You can use playsand unless you are planning on a serious amount of planting. Still possible but you will need to get a heater cable for the substrate and add a clay-based fert. A few swords will do fine without it

Try adding some blackwater extract (I make my own from alder cones) or filter through peat. You r water will get a bit of a yellow/brownish colouration and your fish's colours will show up better.

Holger

I was on about the coral raising the ph not the colour. The chap was having problems with a very high ph.

Referring to Damian's initial question about using sand in a tank and Gavin's reply that fish look pale over it. Not Didniho's issue with this pH.

Never had a problem with the playsand, its easy to clean and gives a great effect.

I'll be switching to Africans in a few months.
Maybe 6 or so.

After I move to a big house.

After I get the wife to agree to another tank......

can give you any help with that..I have my missus driven demented.just get the new tank have a row and stay in the dog house for a bit. then sit back and enjoy.that's the way I do it anyways.

can give you any help with that..I have my missus driven demented.just get the new tank have a row and stay in the dog house for a bit. then sit back and enjoy.that's the way I do it anyways.

Wise man once say 'It is easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission'.

Of course, wise man usually walked with limp.

Referring to Damian's initial question about using sand in a tank and Gavin's reply that fish look pale over it. Not Didniho's issue with this pH.

Maybe I took you up wrong.
I took it you taught I ment that white sand is bad for Angels.

Playsand is cheap filthy and not worth the hassle, but the golden sand from a petshop. Maybe I got the wrong brand but it was filthy, extremely hard to clean and clouded the tank for days. As soon as a fish swam over it the tank was white again.

the brand from the early centre on mary is perfect. It's called "zoom beach" I don't recomend any other brands as they usually have salt traces and are too manky to put in a tank (it is a golden colour not white) we also sell a very fine grade inert silica sand that is pure white but as I said fish tend to look washed out on it and it looks many after a couple of week in any case. some marine keepers swear by it though. think marines are more apt to keep their colour over a white base. not too sure of the technical reason for this, I'm sure someone on here has an idea though.

I have to say that I'm completely tangled now with my posts.

I wrote about sand and gravel plant friendliness here
And I could actually continue from a different perspective.

I kind of feel like lecturing so sorry about this Information is a bit like overall info not just for the original question. I love side tracks today. I'm hoping someone would find some useful information anyway.

The color of the sand is not just a esthetical point but also very important point what it comes to fish behaviour. Timid species tend to disappear in to the shades in too light substrate. Example of this Green neon tetra. It doesn't like the bright areas since that would make the fish in wild easy target for predators - glimpse of the bright coloured side would yell to predators "here here!". Colour is bright so that the group would stay together in dark coloured waters not because fish wants to be eaten (as in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy cows of the restaurant). Green neon has this same characteristic in the tank as well and that is a good reason to pick darker substrate - in terms of behaviour of the Green Neon it doesn't matter if the darker substrate is gravel or sand.

(Oh. New sidetrack again..) Also in the case of shy fish I have found useful to add already mentioned black water extract or the peat filtration if the fish in question is from black water.
Not the most beautiful if added as much as you actually should but makes the closed ecosystem much more natural for fish and you could actually see the fish you bought.

More behavioural examples are cichlids. Part of their natural behaviour is digging a hole as a part of spawning. If you have these species pick sand even though it goes from one end to another when fish is processing the hole

Then Corydoras-species are one reason to pick sand or at least round gravel (which is the best for plant roots as well). There are at least two reasons why the moustache of Corydoras disappear: bad water conditions and too pointy gravel. Best option is to pick sand.

I don't know how it is in case of Irish sand but there are sand types on the Earth (I play it safe... ) that are a bit darker (meaning not white) and that not change the water conditions.

I would also like to add so that Angels do occur in white sand but the main detail of this enviroment is that there are lots of roots and plants in the water which create big shades over the water. Sand might be white but it won't appear white because of the surrounding details. Angelfish coloration is actually a camouflage. If you look at the fish you first see the bodyshape which allows them to hide among roots and plants and then natural colored (natural color of the Angel is grey with black/brown stripes) Angels have stripe / stripes that make it possible to look like a branch. Think about mangrove-forests. Wikipedia Mangrove
Other coloration of the Angels are actually bred so they don't naturally exist.

Sorry. I got carried away.

Hi Sarah,
some fair points. I use sand, white, cream, golden, call it what you like. With softwater species just filter over peat or add blackwater extract and they will show their colours. I have a 600l Discus tank with rummynoses and cardinals with very few plants in it.

One slight bit of critisism, mangrove forest are a thing of coastline and estuaries not the Amazon. But I know what you trying to tell us. Loads of cover over the fish. And some Amazonian habitats are not called Balckwater for nothing

Holger

Yes. Mangrove was a bit of an image really. Something that would demonstrate the idea of the longitudinal stripe. If we are talking about normal roots it's easy to see them as a transverse objects and with that image in head it doesn't quite make sense in terms of stripes. Good that you pointed that easily misleading thing there!

I have got Discus , Cardinals , Rummy Nose and 2 plecs.

I was going to use this
www.petshoponline.ie/customer/product.ph...p;cat=603&page=1

Damian,
no go, did you see the size of the stuff? 6-18mm. Much too coarse, food will sink into it and start rotting.
With Discus sand is best unless you want to go for bare bottom.
I mentioned this before, I have used Gelnview builder's sand and B&Q own brand play sand. Works fine. All leftover food can be easily siphoned off and you can just run your fingers through it every couple of weeks to avoid any dead spots.

Holger

Just an update of the dead spots in my tank.

I moved all the rocks to one end of the tank and gave most of the sand a good stir, removing tons of that black and green stuff into the water.

I had to also uproot a heap of vallis and fern, which Deecos fish are currently eating I imagine! That vallis just takes over everything!

Anyway both filters clogged up a day later, almost totally full of thick black 'mud' (the tank water was cloudy during this, but not totally opaque).

Thanks for the tip lads, I'll keep the sand better agitated in future.

This isn't too far off the questions raised in this post but I saw some black crushed glass "sand" today in a tank and wondered if it would be suitable to use or would it be too coarse on the fish such as albino cory?

I like the idea of the sand that Damien has mentioned but will it cause problems with the filter as Didihno mentioned above when agitated?

I dont want to go for gravel in my new tanks but would want to make sure that sand is the way to go too!!

Glass sand and corys is a no go. Their barbels will be ripped to shred in it. There is natural sand dyed black on the market that would be suitable.