Bad few days of fish keeping

Hi lads,

Over the past few days I've lost 5x Large Angelfish, an 8\" Bala shark, 3x Parrotfish 1xFiremouth Cichilid, a Syno and a 4\" barb.

A couple of weeks ago I purchased 5 Parrotfish. 3 went into a 460 Litre tank in the kitchen, 2 to the 5ft in the living room.

The fish seemed to go a bit pale at first, but then colored up again. A few days later I bought 2x Oscars, a Firemouth and a Syno.

These fish went into the 460 litre with the 3 Parrot fish, all was grand, all were eating.

Last week on thursday or friday the parrotfish seemed to be stressed out, swimming up to one corner of the tank, all nudging each other as if trying to get out of the way of the spray bar. They had no visible signs of illness so I decided to move them into the 5ft in the living room (this was the final nail in the coffin, I believe). The next day, one of the parrot fish in the living room tank were dead. I went to look in the 460 litre and found the Syno dead and the Oscars pale with clouded/glazed over eyes. I did an immediate 50% or more water change on both tanks. Later on in the day all 3 of the parrotfish I had moved were dead. The oscars eyes had already cleared up but the Firemouth was still on the bottom, not breathing heavy, just looking stressed, on another note before I went to bed I looked at the tank in the living room and the fish seemed like they werent as bad anymore (the bala shark was fine), I planned on doing another water change the next morning (Sunday). I got up to find the Bala shark completely off color, really pale and his eyes clouded and his face/gills were light red. I also noticed another Angelfish with glazed over eyes. I did a 50% water change again. No fish died early in the day but late at night fish that seemed fine earlier ( 4 inch barb, he was same as always, not off color etc) but now he was totally pale and his eyes clouded over too. Then angel after angel started to go down to the bottom/get glazed over eyes and die. The balashark ended up going upside down on the gravel then going upright and swimming around for a while, then he died upside down on the bottom.5 of the Angelfish died and the barb died. I also have rosy barbs in the tank, these seem unaffected as well as the corys in the tank. Now the remaining parrot fish in the tank are up in a corner, one behind the other and look as if they're nudging each other up out of the water, with 2 others on the bottom. I obviously passed over whatever has caused with when I moved the 3 Parrot fish over. My question is has anyone got any idea what disease this is by the symptoms? Going pale, eyes clouding, going down to the bottom etc. I also noticed a silver dollar was unaffected by all this and 2 clown loach have their dorsals down and look stressed, on closer inspection they seem to have some white over them, not like ich or white spot, almost like mucas in places. I tested the ammonia and nitrite over the couple of days and got 0 on both counts in each of the tanks. I also had Rainbow rock in the tank the original parrot fish came from, this is now out. Today the oscars are fine and eating, eyes no longer clouded. Corys etc, Silverdollar are fine with the clown loach still looking stressed(occasionally hitting themselves off the gravel, obviously irritated by something) and the parrot fish as above. I made a terrible mistake moving the parrot fish and am gutted that I killed so many fish in doing so. Any input would be much appreciated on what treatment I could use, and what disease this might be or whatever else it might be.


Regards

Tom

Hi Tom,
Sorry to hear about the losses, its hell when it happens, judgeing by your descriptions of the symptoms i would guess that your fish are affected by an ecoparasitic infection(protozoan or skin fluke) for your remaining fish i would reccommend using an ectoparasite remedy, if it is more onto the skin flukes side (you might have noticed something besides mucus on the sides of the fish) then consider praziquantel @10mg/litre for a 3 hour bath..
Hope this helps
Seamus

You could try Waterlife Protozin. I've found it very effective fot skin fluke type diseases.

I agree with John.From your description it was a hard and fast wipeout.AFAIK parasites dont act this fast.Bacterial infections that attack the kidneys and other internal organs usually lead to clouded eyes or popeye etc but again I havent seen or heard of such fast acting bacteria.

In the case of poisoning,damage to these organs could have the same effects as bacterial infection.If I had to say Id guess water poisoning.

Thanks for the replies lads. The water hasn't tasted any different than usual, and things seemed to improve when I'd done a water change. I hadn't done a water change in a couple of days on the tank I'd put the parrot fish into, if it was water poisoning would they have passed it onto the other fish before they died? I'm afraid I haven't got any polyfilter. I'll see tomorrow if the petshop here has any. In the rush to try and save the fish I never tested the tap water,I hadn't done a water change on the tanks in a few days before this happened so I didn't think the water was the culprit. I'll do 2 more 50% water changes tomorrow, is there any broad spectrum treatment I could add to the tank to try and help at all?

Thanks

Tom

Looks as though there may be a case of fin rot in the tank containing the oscars now, or is part of whatever is killing the fish. Despite this the oscars seem ok and are eating/swimming up to be fed etc.

I was up during the night and had a look in the tank containing the oscars/silver dollar. In the space of about 4 hours the silver dollar has 3 cotton wool like spots on his side, and appears to have fin rot. I have no idea what to start treating, or what to treat with. I'm going to do two 50% water changes now.

Hi TomNolan, Sorry to hear about your troubles. regarding the silverdollar I would recommend putting him in quarantine so the other fish are not effected. It sounds like a fungus known as Columnaris on the fish and can be treated with medications e.g. methylene blue available in most petshops. Hope this helps!!

I've treated both tanks with Methylene blue now, before hand I changed 50% of water from each. I've done all I can now, time to wait and see what happens.

MEth BLue will seriously effect your nitrifying process so monitor ammonia and nitrite.Columnaris is a bacteria and would not take hold so quickly in a tank.

It is often mistaken for a fungal infection because of its mold-like lesions.Columnaris is a common bacterial infection in cultured fish, particularly livebearing fish and catfish. Its name is derived from columnar shaped bacteria, which are present in virtually all aquarium environments.
The bacteria are most likely to infect fish that have been stressed by such conditions as poor water quality, inadequate diet, or handling and shipping. Columnaris can enter the fish through the gills, mouth, or via small wounds on the skin. The disease is highly contagious and may be spread through contaminated nets, specimen containers, and even food.


Columnaris can be external or internal and may follow a chronic or acute course. Lesions in chronic cases progress slowly, taking many days before culminating in fish death.

ChrisM - quoting from the same article which you took from freshaquarium.about.com/cs/disease/p/columnaris.htm

\"In acute cases the lesions spread quickly, often wiping out entire populations of fish within hours. High water temperatures accelerate the progression of the disease; however lowering the water temp will not affect the outcome of the disease.\"

IMO if it starts internally it may go unnoticed but can kill fish very quickly - something I have experienced in the past.

Very fair point but it doesnt apply in this case.

My question is has anyone got any idea what disease this is by the symptoms? Going pale, eyes clouding, going down to the bottom etc.

The lesions came as a secondary infection (probably fungal) and only manifested after the above syptoms first appeared.This rules out acute and chronic columnaris like bacteria as the direct disease imo.

Although it is possible in my experiences I never saw columnaris manifest itself this way.My guess is a case of water contaminants weakening the immune systems then bacterial infections getting a stronghold,maybe even columnaris?


In saying all of this, Ihave seen fishkeepers stumped on diseases many times.I think there are more strains of nasties out there than we could imagine,its all a lottery.

ATM I am treating one fish with Clout,why,because I heard another guy state symptoms similar to my fishes and he calimed Clout worked.If I dont treat the fish will die so it cant do any harm.

WHen a fish can be saved it is important to treat with the right medication.Meth BLue can wipe out filter bacteria and should be used very carefully.If I was recommending this I would also advise to use recommended dosage.

Recently I had a case of pH scald occurring,tap water went from 8+ to 6.5.I almost treated with meds but decided to test pH.If I added meds I could have wiped out my tank.Like I say we all learn something new everyday.

Any update on your tank situation Tom ? Hope things are much improving .....

I lost all but one of the parrot fish, there's about 10 Rosy barbs, a pleco and a few corys in the living rooms tank. The Pleco appears to have frayed fins/fin rot? Also the Pleco in the kitchens tank has the same. The two oscars are fine. I lost the clown loach/silver dollar etc. I've been treating with Methylene blue, will this have any effect on fin rot or whatever is doing this to plecos fins? They're not being nipped.

Cheers

Tom

Sorry to hear that Tom.I,m afraid im not that familiar with treatments etc,have been pretty lucky to date and havnt needed to use any.I have 2 bala,s outgrowing my tank ii,d like to give you if your interested and when ready if that was soonish seeing as though you had a bad loss,there getting a bit giddy for the other smaller fish in the tank ........

As soon as I get the tanks sorted I'll take you up on the offer if they're still available. My bala shark was 8 inches and a beauty. What size are they? And where abouts are you based?


Cheers

Tom

No probs Tom,their about 6 inches from head to end of tail and growing fast and i,m in dublin 1...........

Thanks Nomad, if they're still available when my tanks are sorted I'll give you a pm. I'm in Gorey so it's not that far.

One thing that is bothering me is how in a tank that so many fish died so suddenly, how are 14 rosy barbs totally unaffected?