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Retirement and forum shutdown (17 Jan 2022)

Hi,

John Howell who has managed the forum for years is getting on and wishes to retire from the role of managing it.
Over the years, he has managed the forum through good days and bad days and he has always been fair.
He has managed to bring his passion for fish keeping to the forum and keep it going for so long.

I wish to thank John for his hard work in keeping the forum going.

With John wishing to "retire" from the role of managing the forum and the forum receiving very little traffic, I think we must agree that forum has come to a natural conclusion and it's time to put it to rest.

I am proposing that the forum be made read-only from March 2022 onwards and that no new users or content be created. The website is still registered for several more years, so the content will still be accessible but no new topics or replies will be allowed.

If there is interest from the ITFS or other fish keeping clubs, we may redirect traffic to them or to a Facebook group but will not actively manage it.

I'd like to thank everyone over the years who helped with forum, posted a reply, started a new topic, ask a question and helped a newbie in fish keeping. And thank you to the sponsors who helped us along the away. Hopefully it made the hobby stronger.

I'd especially like to thank John Howell and Valerie Rousseau for all of their contributions, without them the forum would have never been has successful.

Thank you
Darragh Sherwin

A single beta in a 20 litre?

  • Penguin (Penguin)
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11 Mar 2007 16:45 #1 by Penguin (Penguin)
A single beta in a 20 litre? was created by Penguin (Penguin)
I have a 20 litre tank that my original goldfish came in a few years ago; it has a hood and a good filter. I upgraded immediately of course, and the 20 litre has been hiding in the corner as a quarantaine tank. But my current set-up is stable and I doubt I'll be adding any fish anytime soon, so I've been thinking what to do with the small tank.

I've been considering a single male beta (would need to buy a heater, but that shouldn't be a problem), and setting up the tank in my office. Another of the managers is a fishie person, so getting the fish fed when I am on holidays won't be a problem, though the fish may go without food from Friday eve to Monday morning. What do you think? Is it cruel to keep a beta by itself? If not, is a 20 litre tank enough? If it isn't, is there anything else I could keep in it?

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11 Mar 2007 19:52 #2 by JohnH (John)
Penguin,
Would this tank have sufficient lighting to sustain some plant life, Bettas are certainly happier in a planted tank than with none.

If you think about it, if you fed him on Friday when you were leaving the office and again on Monday on returning I don't think it would be too much of a hardship for a Betta...IMO fish do not suffer from going without food for a couple of days.

John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


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12 Mar 2007 02:44 #3 by Penguin (Penguin)
Replied by Penguin (Penguin) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
The light is quite strong yes (I always thought it too bright for the goldfish). But it's not a special light, I don't think (the tank is a standard starter goldfish tank, ie not really suitable for goldfish!).

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13 Mar 2007 12:18 #4 by Anthony (Anthony)
Replied by Anthony (Anthony) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
You don`t need a heater with Betas, unless you are breeding them.

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13 Mar 2007 12:37 #5 by tanks_alot (Denis Coghlan)
I know that people around the world keep Betta's in small containers and it works well. But I am of the opinion that the best thing to do with a 20lt bowl/tank is to fill it full of water and put flowers in it.

The only other option IMO is to use it a a fry tank with an air powered filter on it.

If you are going to keep a fish in a setup long term, you should give it the best environment possible.

Lead me not into temptation, For I can find it myself!

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13 Mar 2007 19:41 #6 by arabesque (Mick Veale)
I used to keep a beta in a small 3 litre vase on my desk
in my old job..

a small heater in it set at 28.
fed freezedried bloodworm.

changed his water every day
and last thing on friday i feed and watered
him and .. put a little lid over the vase
to keep the air temp the same
and he thrived...

even got him handfeeding bloodworm.
holding it a bit above the water level and
he'd jump out and snatch it from my fingers.

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13 Mar 2007 19:42 #7 by arabesque (Mick Veale)
.. and he was still thriving 12 months later

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14 Mar 2007 02:17 #8 by apistodiscus (apistodiscus)
Replied by apistodiscus (apistodiscus) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
You can keep a Betta in a small tank like this. You don't need any airpumps etc. since betta have a auxillary breathing organ called a labyrinth with which they can breath atmospheric air.
The only problem I see is temperature. Bettas like it hot and the atmosphereic air they breath should be equally as warm.

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14 Mar 2007 03:56 #9 by JohnH (John)
I don't know why I didn't think of this before...I have a male Paradise Fish in a small tank (about the same capacity as your one, I'd guess) and that's fine.

I have no heater or filtration but this thrives and has done now for getting on for a year.

OK, so Paradise aren't quite as coloured as some male Bettas can be but they're still great characters and, like the description Holger gives for the Betta, they have the auxiliary air-breathing apparatus; but because they come from a cooler area in China they are more at home with lower temperatures.

In the same sized tank next to it I also have (again no heater) half a dozen White Clouds, also from a cooler area, but this time with a gentle u/g filter running.

So, there's a couple of other options for you to consider...and both which will live perfectly happily at normal room temperature. No doubt, if Platty's around he'll be able to suggest types of Killies which would also be fine at the lower temps - I recall his postings to that effect some time before Christmas.

John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


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It's a long way to Tipperary.

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14 Mar 2007 04:19 #10 by apistodiscus (apistodiscus)
Replied by apistodiscus (apistodiscus) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
Good call John. Paradise fish would be the ticket for a tank like this. Incidentially they were the first 'tropicals' brought to Europe. They are as tough as old leather boots. I used to have them back in the year dot...
Easy to breed to if you have the space for all those young. You can also keep them in a garden pond in the summer. Just make sure no cats, heron or mink can get at them.

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14 Mar 2007 07:52 #11 by Penguin (Penguin)
Replied by Penguin (Penguin) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
I will ask the local shop about paradise fish, thanks!

In regards to the filter: are you sure I don't need one? The tank has a hood (only a plastic thing, not fitting too snuggly), so surely there would not be enough air exchange without a filter?

BTW, asked the boss today about having the tank- thought it was wiser ust in case something happened and it leaked all over my expensive computer equipment- she said no problem and even offered me some money towards it, as a stress reliever! (I have the corner desk in an open plan office). Hurray!

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14 Mar 2007 08:02 #12 by JohnH (John)
A filter which doesn't create too much flow or turbulence would be OK, Paradise are reasonably sedentary fish and wouldn't appreciate bieng in a mini-river situation.

But from a point of view of air exchange you would find that this would happen naturally if the lid wasn't too tightly-fitting...I'm no scientist so perhaps someone better able could explain this more accurately than ever I would be able to?

John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


ITFS member.



It's a long way to Tipperary.

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14 Mar 2007 08:06 #13 by apistodiscus (apistodiscus)
Replied by apistodiscus (apistodiscus) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
Don't think that the lid should restrict airflow too much. If in doubt drill a 5mm hole or two in the lid. Problem solved

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14 Mar 2007 08:53 #14 by tanks_alot (Denis Coghlan)
I keep paradise fish at the moment! I have two males in a 100lt tank with a couple of other cold water species, rice fish, WWCM's, hill stream loaches, weather loaches, killies. I agree with holger about not having too much water flow in the tank, but I have to in mine to keep the hill streams happy. I combat this by putting in lots of features that create eddies and areas of still water.

I would still think it would be best if you put in some sort of filtration. I would recommend a sponge filter of some sort. It will help oxygenate the water and act as a bacterial filter. Have a look at the Interpet Airstream Single Sponge Filter offered on aquatic-online.com



sponge filter

The only other thing you would need is a small air pump to run the filter. But if your boss is offering to donate some money that shouldnt be a problem.

Couple of pics of my paradise fish!







WWMC's

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14 Mar 2007 11:03 #15 by Sean (Fr. Jack)
I used to keep white clouds in a very small pond under deep shade out side in Majorca, the white clouds used to breed and I never bothered to feed them, I fact because I never fed them I forgot about them, and pulled back some plants one day to view the "hidden pond" and it was all bone dry, pity I did not top it up every so often.

That would be a ecumenical matter!!!

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15 Mar 2007 06:57 #16 by Penguin (Penguin)
Replied by Penguin (Penguin) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
Thanks guys. The tank is now installed on my desk, and already attracting lots of comments and questions, giving me an opportunity to explain about cycling tanks and suitable containers for goldfish etc. I've brought in 3 litres of water from my home tank as well as two handfuls of gravel and a sponge squeezing, so hopefully it'll cycle quickly!

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15 Mar 2007 07:03 #17 by tanks_alot (Denis Coghlan)
What did you decide to go with in terms of filtration for the tank?

Lead me not into temptation, For I can find it myself!

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15 Mar 2007 07:22 #18 by Penguin (Penguin)
Replied by Penguin (Penguin) on topic Re: A single beta in a 20 litre?
Currently I have the filter in there that came with the tank- it's one of those that has a funnel and powerhead in one corner of the tank, and then filters the water overhead. I don't think it is a branded filter. Depending on what I'll get in terms of fish, I can upgrade. If I only get a betta and a couple of amano shrimp, which is my current thinking, that filter should do.

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