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Where best to position a check valve ?
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Hi,
John Howell who has managed the forum for years is getting on and wishes to retire from the role of managing it.
Over the years, he has managed the forum through good days and bad days and he has always been fair.
He has managed to bring his passion for fish keeping to the forum and keep it going for so long.
I wish to thank John for his hard work in keeping the forum going.
With John wishing to "retire" from the role of managing the forum and the forum receiving very little traffic, I think we must agree that forum has come to a natural conclusion and it's time to put it to rest.
I am proposing that the forum be made read-only from March 2022 onwards and that no new users or content be created. The website is still registered for several more years, so the content will still be accessible but no new topics or replies will be allowed.
If there is interest from the ITFS or other fish keeping clubs, we may redirect traffic to them or to a Facebook group but will not actively manage it.
I'd like to thank everyone over the years who helped with forum, posted a reply, started a new topic, ask a question and helped a newbie in fish keeping. And thank you to the sponsors who helped us along the away. Hopefully it made the hobby stronger.
I'd especially like to thank John Howell and Valerie Rousseau for all of their contributions, without them the forum would have never been has successful.
Thank you
Darragh Sherwin
Where best to position a check valve ?
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18 Sep 2012 21:39 #1
by barr (declan)
Hi All
I have an air pump and looking to add a check valve, I got one online but there are no instructions with it.
I was wondering what is the best position for it? Should it be placed close to the pump or would it be better close to the air stone.
Advise welcome.
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18 Sep 2012 22:44 #2
by ger310 (Ger .)
Since it's function is to stop water from being siphoned all the way up and down the tubing,i would say any position is fine.....i know i have placed it in lots of positions with no problems but i would imagine just above the water line would be the correct position
Ger
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A Wonkey....duh ha 
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18 Sep 2012 22:47 #3
by JohnH (John)
It doesn't really matter - you can position it where it is most convenient to yourself.
I think they are useful, but prefer not to use them myself as they really seem to use a lot of the pressure coming from the pump to get past them.
However, all this inconvenience could soon be forgotten in the event of a power cut when water can readily syphon back into the pump, replacing the air and that can spell trouble.
You could get over this potential problem by positioning the pump a foot or so above water level since the syphon effect shouldn't allow the water to rise that high, but as you have one now you may as well use it.
Hope that is of some help, can anyone add to this? (Please).
John
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19 Sep 2012 00:45 #4
by maggy88 (Wayne Mc Glynn)
non return valves can be positioned anywhere along the line but if you have 2 airlines t'd together then the best place is between the t and the pump, best position would be somewhere with easy access as they sometimes fail, when your pump is turned off just have a quick look to make sure the valve is still working. non return valves are by no means bulletproof and water can sometimes pass if even the smallest bit of dirt gets in between the diaphram and the body, i have first hand experience with them from the plumbing trade, although smaller the principle is the same. hope that helps?
wayne
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19 Sep 2012 22:07 #5
by barr (declan)
It doesn't really matter - you can position it where it is most convenient to yourself.
I think they are useful, but prefer not to use them myself as they really seem to use a lot of the pressure coming from the pump to get past them.
However, all this inconvenience could soon be forgotten in the event of a power cut when water can readily syphon back into the pump, replacing the air and that can spell trouble.
You could get over this potential problem by positioning the pump a foot or so above water level since the syphon effect shouldn't allow the water to rise that high, but as you have one now you may as well use it.
Hope that is of some help, can anyone add to this? (Please).
John
Hey John , I was just wondering how does a power cut cause the water to siphon back into the pump ? Just a bit confused how that happens.
Would a power cut not have the same effect as switching off the power from the wall.
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19 Sep 2012 22:21 #6
by JohnH (John)
Indeed it would and the result might well be the same.
It's the release of air pressure which causes a syphon effect. Now, most times the water will only come up the airline to the level of the water in the tank but it can (and will do - I can attest to this) seep above surface level then down and into the pump, spelling disaster (and potential danger - water and electricity are not the best of bed-fellows!).
Theoretically the check valve should stop this happening, but as Wayne tells us, they aren't foolproof for reasons he gives. But...they offer a great deal more safety than if not used.
John
Location:
N. Tipp
We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.
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20 Sep 2012 19:53 #7
by barr (declan)
All this talk about the water siphoning off into the pump is scary. I was hoping the check valve would give 100% protection.
Once the pump is switched off is there still the risk the water could siphon out of the tank ?
I was thinking along the lines of leaving the air stone in the water over night with the power turned off at the socket.
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20 Sep 2012 22:02 #8
by maggy88 (Wayne Mc Glynn)
i use check valves on all my airlines because it happened to me before and ruined my pump. water will syphon back through the pipe by gravity, to prevent this some people place their pump above water level which prevents this as water can't travel upwards without being propelled (pumped) but can it be an eye sore. i'd reccommend using a check valve because they're cheap and they do the job, as i said they can sometimes fail but if you check it every so often you can prevent any mishaps.
when the pump is off it's most vulnerable to a syphon effect simply because there is no air pressure in the pipe to displace the water, but the addition of a check valve will allow you to turn the pump off without any worries. i would say there is less than a 5% chance of the valve failing but there is still a slight risk. i would use the valve, don't worry about it failing as there is only a slight chance but just keep an eye on it for a few seconds after the pump is turned off and you'll see if it is syphoning back or not. if it is syphoning back then just turn the pump back on (which will push any water back out of the pipe) and replace the valve. job done.
hopefully that has reassured you mate.
wayne
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20 Sep 2012 22:16 - 20 Sep 2012 22:17 #9
by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
All this talk about the water siphoning off into the pump is scary. I was hoping the check valve would give 100% protection.
Once the pump is switched off is there still the risk the water could siphon out of the tank ?
I was thinking along the lines of leaving the air stone in the water over night with the power turned off at the socket.
Wouldn't worry to much about it mate with the Check Valve on the right way around you can turn it on and off all you want without the water siphoning back up the line
Sean
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22 Sep 2012 13:20 - 22 Sep 2012 13:21 #10
by barr (declan)
just keep an eye on it for a few seconds after the pump is turned off and you'll see if it is syphoning back or not. if it is syphoning back then just turn the pump back on (which will push any water back out of the pipe) and replace the valve. job done.
Ah ok this is reassuring
What I was afraid of was it siphoning in the middle of the night or the valve failing when I wasn’t there.
I didn’t realise the risk of the siphoning could only happen in the fist few seconds when the pump is switched off.
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22 Sep 2012 14:40 #11
by maggy88 (Wayne Mc Glynn)
yeh once there is air pushing through the pipe then water can't come back through as the pressure of the air would be greater than that of the water - if that makes sense to you? when the pump is turned off would be the only time it could siphon back but then that's what the valve is there for!! you have nothing to worry about mate, i only told you about the slightest possibility of the valve failing just so you're aware that they can sometimes fail, didn't mean to scare you
just add the valve and your sorted pal.
wayne
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Where best to position a check valve ?
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