Censorship on Forum ??????

A recent thread entitled "Tropheus Noob" appeared on the forum, where a member admitted taking sand from Coral Beach in Carraroe, Co Galway.

A number of members including myself, expressed our annoyance at this irresponsible and illegal act.

This thread has now been removed.

I wonder; does this mean that the removal of sand is being condoned by the 'powers to be' or is there another explanation?

I agree with Christyg on this. I too would like an explanation.
I do hope that there is.

Hmmm,I wonder if the fish keeping hobbyist would spare the time to put the sand back on the beach after there finish with there fish keeping hobby,I there for must agree with the above

I'm not a moderator so don't know but it would simply appear that one forum member did this unknowingly and got attacked in here for the same. Kind of like its my way or the highway. I have noticed this practice increasingly occurring in recent times and this witch hunt mentality isn't a good thing. So you have got to ask who is censoring who here???? Express a view that isn't in line with the masses and your beaten within inches of your proverbial life with other messages....now that's censorship through oppression.... Just my opinion and while I don't condone the particular declaration of the practice around the sand per se, I for one van see why the moderator bought this under control. Poster was crucified......that's real censorship........

I didn't notice that the thread had been removed.

I had contributed to the fish-keeping side of the thread, but decided to leave it when the discussion on the removal of stuff from a beach entered into it.

Maybe the discussion on should people remove or not remove sand/coral sand from a non-sustainable or whatever be brought up as a separate thread.

On such a thread I would express my opinion, and that is that removal of sand/coral sand from a non-sustainable or replenisahble source should not be done......and not be done for numerous reasons.

As for why the said thread was removed?.....I have not the foggiest.
Certainly I did not see any agro going on whilst I was browsing it. But then maybe some remarks did get onto it that could be why it was removed....I don't know.

ian

It seems to me that those who wish the law upheld are in the minority on this subject.
It has nothing to do with "my way or the highway" or "censorship of the masses"
The silent majority on this subject are testament to this.
I wonder if it was closer to home would others be more interested.

Gonefishy wrote:

I'm not a moderator so don't know but it would simply appear that one forum member did this unknowingly and got attacked in here for the same. Kind of like its my way or the highway. I have noticed this practice increasingly occurring in recent times and this witch hunt mentality isn't a good thing. So you have got to ask who is censoring who here???? Express a view that isn't in line with the masses and your beaten within inches of your proverbial life with other messages....now that's censorship through oppression.... Just my opinion and while I don't condone the particular declaration of the practice around the sand per se, I for one van see why the moderator bought this under control. Poster was crucified......that's real censorship........

Disagreeing with an opinion is called debate and discussion. Expressing dissatisfaction at an illegal act is not censorship in any way shape or form. The vast majority of fishkeepers are conservationalists at heart (whether they realise it or not) and removing sand from a protected beach is to be frowned on and discouraged at every opportunity.

Didn't see the thread buts what is the difference between removing sand/coral from a beach in ireland and removing sand and coral from any other place around the world that is then placed in our LFS for us all to buy? If its wrong to do it in Galway surely it's wrong to do it anywhere else?

Don't pick me up incorrectly here. Im not condoning anything. have just commented that I have noticed in recent times certain members 'attacking' others for their expressed opinion. in this instance i dont think the poster knew they were doing anything wrong. Debate and discussion is healthy and why we all come in here but being torn apart is another....

Gonefishy wrote:

Don't pick me up incorrectly here. Im not condoning anything. have just commented that I have noticed in recent times certain members 'attacking' others for their expressed opinion. in this instance i dont think the poster knew they were doing anything wrong. Debate and discussion is healthy and why we all come in here but being torn apart is another....

^^ I agree.

I don't mind a good old debate, argument or discussion, but I wish the attacks on persons would stop.

ian

Mike53 wrote:

Didn't see the thread buts what is the difference between removing sand/coral from a beach in ireland and removing sand and coral from any other place around the world that is then placed in our LFS for us all to buy? If its wrong to do it in Galway surely it's wrong to do it anywhere else?

The coral strand in Carraroe, is protected by law, therefore the removal of sand is breaking the law.
Coral sand, as with live rock etc. sold from our LFS should have been collected from a sustainable source, and have paperwork stating so, to be allowed enter the EU. Taking it, or importing it from protected areas is illegal.
Not all countries have the same laws on this subject, or enforce them with the same vigor.
But to answer your question, yes if it is wrong to do it, without permission in Galway, it is also wrong to do it, without permission in Indonesia, Bermuda or anywhere else for that matter.

Gonefishy wrote:

Don't pick me up incorrectly here. Im not condoning anything. have just commented that I have noticed in recent times certain members 'attacking' others for their expressed opinion. in this instance i dont think the poster knew they were doing anything wrong. Debate and discussion is healthy and why we all come in here but being torn apart is another....

Attacking someone for an 'expressed opinion' and attacking someone for an irresponsible and illegal act of removing material from a unique and protected environment are completely different.

lads i must agree with GoneFishy and its written in the forum rules that any direct attack on any member will not be tollerated so why should it be different because this member was none-the-wiser?? how many people come and ask about doing this on fish forums?... well thank god they ask 1st!!

how many have collected shells from these beaches when kids or collect driftwood for their tanks?? i'd say the answer is more than you care to imagine... well not everyone knows all this before acting and its quite a shame they get abused for such a harmless mistake!!

we could have alot bigger problems if tomorrows voting goes acording to the same way voting has previously gone in this country but who cares... lets all care about some stupid sand being removed from a stupid beach... grow the hell up lads!!

Jesus Davey be careful........lock all the doors and windows......the Galway boys will be coming for you......

Gonefishy wrote:

Jesus Davey be careful........lock all the doors and windows......the Galway boys will be coming for you......

haha, just don't go robbin off my turf ... maybe i need a pint tonight

Obey forum rules by all means, yes, but obey the countries rules too. One might not agree with them, but the rules are there.
Sea-shells and driftwood are not in the same category, the Coral/Marl from Carraroe is from a heritage site.
You might think that its a stupid beach, that is your right, but the 1000's of tourists who come every year to visit don't think so, nor do the guest-houses and pubs nearby. It the sand goes so does their livelihood.
As to the voting, again we have a democratic choice in that, one we should all exercise.

Gonefishy wrote:

Jesus Davey be careful........lock all the doors and windows......the Galway boys will be coming for you......

The van is loaded with Hurley's, and we are on the way!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe next year you'll use them better than this one.....from a limerick man

you dusted that off nicely crusty,the turf is all yours

Gonefishy wrote:

Maybe next year you'll use them better than this one.....from a limerick man

at least we got there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did not see this thread but definitely believe just like a lot of you's that the person was none the wiser i had no idea about that rule, Also agree with a comment above on whats the difference between taking non sustainable item from an Irish or many non sustainable items that are sold in our LFS.

Maybe create a sticky of what is illegal to take from beaches and so on, As kids i'm sure many caught tadpoles now its not allowed.

I can't comment on any of the possible bullying from a group as i didn't see the thread but i think everybody should treated as not knowing any better rather than forcing the law on them.

well if it causes that much trouble i wish it would go out on the same tide it came in on... maybe they should put up signs for tourists robbing stones to be able to say 'that stone came from such a beach'... i'd say everyone has family who does it and when mine are holidaying here their luggage goes home a couple of stones heavier

is building sand castles and digging holes to form a water hole seen as defacing the beach or vandalism?.. wouldn't be surprised

davey_c wrote:

well if it causes that much trouble i wish it would go out on the same tide it came in on... maybe they should put up signs for tourists robbing stones to be able to say 'that stone came from such a beach'... i'd say everyone has family who does it and when mine are holidaying here their luggage goes home a couple of stones heavier

is building sand castles and digging holes to form a water hole seen as defacing the beach or vandalism?.. wouldn't be surprised

I did not make the law, but like everyone else I am expected to obey the law.
We as a nation have some strange laws, some a hangover from a colonial past, and some from our new political masters in europe.
Some we like and some we dislike.

Jambomac wrote:

Did not see this thread but definitely believe just like a lot of you's that the person was none the wiser i had no idea about that rule, Also agree with a comment above on whats the difference between taking non sustainable item from an Irish or many non sustainable items that are sold in our LFS.

Maybe create a sticky of what is illegal to take from beaches and so on, As kids i'm sure many caught tadpoles now its not allowed.

I can't comment on any of the possible bullying from a group as i didn't see the thread but i think everybody should treated as not knowing any better rather than forcing the law on them.

There is no difference on removing non sustainable items from an Irish or other site. There should be no non sustainable items that are sold in our LFS.

I'm waiting for the referendum to stop us foreigners coming over here and stealing the local Irish Women....

...I have stolen from Wicklow mountains and D4 by the way (even though some local guys say the women are 'protected' beauty spots)

igmillichip wrote:

I'm waiting for the referendum to stop us foreigners coming over here and stealing the local Irish Women....

...I have stolen from Wicklow mountains and D4 by the way (even though some local guys say the women are 'protected' beauty spots)

Wicklow women! you are a brave man
D4 You must have had a skinfull

ye have good taste ian, personally i wouldn't go for anything other than an irish woman

to find one of them now sur you'll have to go to austrailia,very rare these days lads

Wicklow Mountains first....horsey woman.
The latest addition to my life is from D4.....lovely girl, mad as a hatter, really great fish keeper as well,.......and I never had any Galway lads to fight me off. !!

On the subject of mad laws, I come from a place that has some of the maddest local laws....so I'm certainly never surprised at what might be out there.

ian

I have no problem with removing sand etc from a beach to furnish a tank, it really is just a drop in the ocean, and if "we" have to have a moderated / controlled view on then let it be more in line with cleaning up our beaches as in, you may remove a big bag of rubbish / empty beer cans etc and find yourself in possesion of a couple of nice rocks or even a bucket load of sand.