Gouramis and Internal Bacteria Infections

I’ve just lost my third male gourami to what appears to be an internal bacteria infection. For those of you not familiar, the symptoms were as follows (in order):

• Stringy white poo
• Listlessness
• Loss of appetite
• Bloated abdomen
• Death

The time from onset to death ranged from 2 to 3 weeks. Thankfully, my remaining 3 gouramis (one male and three females) and 5 corys all appear fine and are not showing any symptoms.

I did a lot of reading over the past few weeks to try and resolve this. Here’s what I learned:

• Gouramis seem prone to these infections. This appears to have only become apparent in recent times and has been put down to breeding practices and overuse of antibiotics on the breeding farms. I heard this from two LFS and was also mentioned in a gourami profile in the recent issue of Practical Fishkeeping.

• The over-the-counter treatments such as Interpet’s Anti Internal Bacteria are of limited use. I used this to treat my three fish with no success.

• The recommended treatment appears to be using medicated fish food – that is fish food that is treated with an antibiotic such as amoxicillin or metronidazole (these are also used to treat humans). These are freely available over the counter in the US (for fish treatment), but appear to be by vetinary prescription only in Europe (but you can get it on eBay from the US). They are also available in capsule form for adding directly to the tank water, however, tropical fish don’t ingest very much tank water so this method is useless for internal infections. Marine fish are different as they do appear to ingest tank water. Adding directly to water could be used to treat external infections for tropical fish, but OTC remedies also appear to be effective in this area.

• The above method is only of use when the fish is still eating enough to get a sufficient amount of medicated food. It’s best to isolate the fish so you can ensure it’s getting enough food. If the fish isn’t eating, then injection with antibiotics is the only other alternative. This works out expensive and can be impractical with small fish.

• Male gouramis are territorial. Adding 4 males and 2 females to a 65 litre tank was not a good idea (although my now ex-LFS thought that it was). There simply wasn’t enough room for the 4 males to establish their territory. This could have been enough to cause stress and make the fish sick. It’s worth noting that I lost 3 males. I think one male and three females would have been more suitable for my tank.

• If the fish has stopped eating and is showing other advanced symptoms, euthanising is really the only option. I have yet to read or hear of a case where a fish has recovered after reaching this stage.

I hope the above is of use to anybody that runs into the same problems. Time is of the essence when treating these infections.

Try getting hold of Anthony, Flubenol might sort it out.

Try getting hold of Anthony, Flubenol might sort it out.

On my to do list to add to my fishy medicine cabinet. Although my understanding is that it's a wormer so probably not going to help here.

However, it I run into the problem again, it can't do any harm to try it.

Hey!...Its been a while since vi been on last!!....my female opline gourami has been producing "Stringy white poo" for nearly a month now!....But shes still eating normally and showing no other signs of illness!!....should i be afraid???... :?

Stringy white poo on it's own is not necessarily something to worry about. It could be that your fish is constipated Have you tried feeding peas? Just microwave frozen peas in some tank water for 1 minute, then shell and cut them up and add to the tank. I feed them to my fish about twice a week and they go down very well.

Ah!...Good to Hear!...Thanks!....ill give the peas a go tonight!

The only sure way of telling if it is bactrial diease is to open up the fish straight after he dies, it will be very smelly inside, look for red marks around the lips or near the anal passage on the outside or internally.
It is true its hard to get hold of antibiotics in Ireland and in the U.S you can buy it over the shelf in pet stores.
How ever where does most Irish take their holidays??
Yes Spain, you can ask for as many boxes as you like in any chemist.
regards
sean
palma de mallorca

Try getting hold of Anthony, Flubenol might sort it out.

On my to do list to add to my fishy medicine cabinet. Although my understanding is that it's a wormer so probably not going to help here.

However, it I run into the problem again, it can't do any harm to try it.

It sounds to me like intestinal flagellets, hence the white stringy pooh.
Solid white pooh usually worms.

Try to get a hold of Augmentum. Be nice to your GP. If it is flagellets, that should sort it. The stuff is used a lot by discus breeders.

This seems to be very common in Gouramis now. I have seen lots of them that are very poor.
I recon a lot of inbreeding going on and the fish have very poor immune systems.
Just my 2 pence worth.

If its early stages Octozin might work but it might be cheaper to buy a new gourami.
Its amazing what people spend on meds to treat fish when sometimes it is miles cheaper to uthanise and replace.I did it myself.

Hi Anthony,

Yes, I agree with you. I'm in the process of treating one of the females I got from Brittas about a month ago. They looked fine when I got them, but one has developed odd white marks on it's body (not white spot, but probably the beginning of ulcers). Yesterday I saw the white stringy poo which I'm all too familar with at this stage.

I've quaranteened her and started treating with Interpet Anti-Internal Bacteria. However, I don't hold out much hope. I think once you see symptoms, it's too late.

That's it for me when it comes to dwarf goramis. This will be my fifth loss to the same illness in five months.

Bet they came from Singapore or Malaysia. I've mentioned this before. Fish from South East Asia are best avoided. European stock is much healthier. A bit more expensive to buy but much better quality fish.
In my mind Interpet Internal Bacteria treatment is pretty useless. Coming to think of it, I don't fancy any of their products. Same goes for King British and Melafix
There are better medications out there and before I get any nasty mails or replies, I have no affiliation with any manufacturer of medications.

Esha and Tetra products are much more effective

Bet they came from Singapore or Malaysia. I've mentioned this before. Fish from South East Asia are best avoided. European stock is much healthier. A bit more expensive to buy but much better quality fish.
In my mind Interpet Internal Bacteria treatment is pretty useless. Coming to think of it, I don't fancy any of their products. Same goes for King British and Melafix
There are better medications out there and before I get any nasty mails or replies, I have no affiliation with any manufacturer of medications.

Esha and Tetra products are much more effective

I have always said that Melafix is useless. Its just tea tree oil. It will only cure stuff that will heal itself anyway.
Although not as popular, Water life make far superier medicinal products.

Worst produst after Melafix has to be WS3 I think thats what it is called, for whitespot.

I have a bad experience of King British, when I was a kid in the eighties I bought one of the first style trickle filters which were just above the water level, and worked by pumping the water up with air just like in an under ground filter. In the ad it say suitable for tropical aquarium (not mentioning fresh water or marine), this was for my first marine tank, it was supported by two metal strips that came in the box that went on top of the glass rim to support the trickle filter.
After 4 months they rusted, the plastic started to crack with the heat from the lights. I found the factory number in England phoned to complained, and there answer was "its not our problem you were stupid enough to put metal close to salt water, ha ha." I said wait a minute there is more demand for trickle filters for marines than freshwater, in your ad it does not say not for salt water aquarium.
They did not want to know, what sort of after sales service is that?

Once you part with your money Sean they don`want to know.

Heres an article by Matt Clarke. I recon it brings closure to the poor Gourami problem.

Ever wondered why Dwarf gouramies are so difficult to keep alive these days? They've been pretty ropey for at least a decade, but new reports from readers have suggested that things have become even worse. Symptoms suggest bacterial infection, but treatment is rarely successful.

I had previously suspected that the indiscriminate use of antibiotics was to blame - this is a big problem in the fish world. However, we can now exclusively reveal that the culprit may be a virus called DGIV. Like other viruses, this one's virtually impossible to detect and there's no cure. But, worse still, it has already spread to other species. Some 22% of Dwarf gouramies tested carried the virus.

Here is some info from PFK about dwarf gouramies.
I have not been able to find the full article on their site.


Ever wondered why Dwarf gouramies are so difficult to keep alive these days? They've been pretty ropey for at least a decade, but new reports from readers have suggested that things have become even worse. Symptoms suggest bacterial infection, but treatment is rarely successful.

I had previously suspected that the indiscriminate use of antibiotics was to blame - this is a big problem in the fish world. However, we can now exclusively reveal that the culprit may be a virus called DGIV. Like other viruses, this one's virtually impossible to detect and there's no cure. But, worse still, it has already spread to other species. Some 22% of Dwarf gouramies tested carried the virus.

Thanks Anthony, just read this on a mail from PFK. I wonder how contageous this is? It would explain a lot and the fact that nobody appears to be having any success treating with antibiotics.

I'm treating one of my female dwarfs at the moment. If there is further disimprovement, I'll euthanise. It's sad. Gouramis are such beautiful fish.