starting off with tropical fish.

not sure if this is the right thread

anyways bought a new aquarium today, a jewel vision 180, its nice and big. lights, filter, heater set to 24c.

filled it up , added a bottle of stress zyme biological filtration booster and

a bottle of dual action stress zyme to the filters as i filled the tank.


after an hour with tank turned on, added 10 goldfish, they seem quite happy, and loads of room to swim round.

i put the goldfish in to help speed things along, in terms of biocycle etc etc to get the tank ready for tropical fish.


so my question is , can i after a week or so , add in tropical fish?

will having the goldfish in the tank help things when i decide to get tropcial fish, ( remove the goldfish and add tropical)
also how often would i need to change the water in the tank with the 10 goldfish i have currently.

also what tropical fish are less messy than others? ie less cleaning to do

thanks

Firstly, welcome to the list. I'm sure you'll find it useful.

Ok, where do I start :?

You don't need a heater for goldfish as they are cold water fish. 24c could be bit too high for them. I would reduce it to 22c or turn it off altogether. You will need it for tropical fish when you add them.

Secondly, you added way too many goldfish and will experience very high ammonia and nitrite spikes over the next few days. 2 or 3 would have been enough to cycle the tank (I presume that's what you're trying to do?). I'm not sure why you chose goldfish to cycle with as you could have achieved this with a couple of hardy tropical fish such as zebra danios.

You need to get yourself a test kit to measure ammonia, nitrITE, nitrATE and your PH. You will get more details at the link below:

www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/wchem.htm

I hope this helps.

hi
i have noticed that the water in the tank is not 100% clear,
is this normal? it appears a tiny bit cloudy .. i used goldfish as i was told that tropical fish would die quickly in a new tank. i tested the nitrate last night and it was at zero.

do you think i should remove some goldfish ? my tank will be one week in operation on saturday next. i intend to put tropical fish in as soon as my tank will support them...then i wont want the goldfish...

also in terms of gravel cleaning , how often do i need to do this? i bought a syphon sort of tank cleaner..

Hi Bradan,

Fisrt the first... Switch off the heater... Goldfish are coldwater fish and they do great without the heater, hi temps will increase the fish metabolism making them require extra oxigen and creating undesired quantities of poo...

Cycling an Aquarium take around 4 weeks so don't be inpatient, if you don't follow the right procedure you're just extending the amount of time the tank will take to cycle.

If i was you take 7 or 8 of those goldfish back to the LFS strait away, you don't need more than a couple of fish to cycle a tank, actually excess of fish will make the ammonia levels to high and probably kill them.

Hope this help!
Pablo

I would remove 5 of the gold fish, you have far too many for a 180 litre tank - for cycling purposes anyway.

You should not see any nitrATE as yet so I would expect that to be zero. You should start seeing ammonia spike over the next few days, this will then be followed by nitrITE (note the ITE) over the next week or so. Only when ammonia and nitrITE are 0, can you safely add more fish. This will mean that your tank has cycled. This could take up to four weeks or more.

Bacteria that will grow in your tank through the cycling process will convert the fish waste (ammonia) to nitrITE and then to nitrATE. The only way to remove nitrATE is through weekly water changes (around 10-20%).

You'll find more details in the link in my previous post.

You will also need to keep an eye on your ammonia and nitrITE levels since you are cycling with fish as these are very toxic to fish. Make sure you keep both below 0.5 ppm through 20% water changes. These will most likely be daily for the next week or so. If you let the levels go above this, you will most likely lose fish.

When changing water, make sure you add stress coat and bring the water up to the tank temperature before adding to the tank. Chlorine and chloramines in tap water will destroy the good bacteria that you are building up through the cycling process. You need to bring the water up to the tank temperature as drastic, sudden swings in water temperature can seriously stress or kill fish.

In terms of gravel vaccing, I wouldn't bother for the first couple of weeks as you want to build up some fish waste to create the good bacteria. Once you have cycled, it's good practice to vac the gravel at every water change. Make sure you get good and deep and get all the gravel in to the syphon as the waste can sink very deep into the gravel.

I hope this helps. Read as much as you can and don't be afraid to ask questions.

If i was you take 7 or 8 of those goldfish back to the LFS strait away, you don't need more than a couple of fish to cycle a tank, actually excess of fish will make the ammonia levels to high and probably kill them.

Bradan,

I agree with Pablo, take 7 of the gold fish back. I said 5 in my post, but on second thoughts, 3 is plenty. Remember to keep an eye on those ammonia and nitrITE levels.

ok im taking the ten fish back to the shop today, there is some fish waste in the tank and that should be enough to help the cycling along, im goin to then leave the tank sit for a few days, until sat ( is this long enough) when i will get 2 hardy tropical fish, and add them, after testing amonia ph and nitrates...

or should i get 1 or 2 tropical fish today when i leave back the goldfish? ( smaller and emit less waste)

i think that 10 goldfish would be too dirty to keep in the tank, for a few weeks, as they are messy buggers....


what temp should i set the tank to after i remove the goldfish today? also should the water in the tank be a little cloudy in normal operation..

also re filter changing, do i need to do this even with an empty tank?(no fish)

also what tropical fish are easy to keep ( less waste) and less maintenance...



thanks for the info.

Hi Bradan,

ok im taking the ten fish back to the shop today, there is some fish waste in the tank and that should be enough to help the cycling along, im goin to then leave the tank sit for a few days, until sat ( is this long enough) when i will get 2 hardy tropical fish, and add them, after testing amonia ph and nitrates...

As i said before, Take 7 or 8 of those golfish back to the LFS and leave a couple , switch off the heater, leave the tank alone for a few days...

You need to monitor the Ammonia and Nitrates and please do not put more fish in the tank until the Ammonia and Nitrates are 0, This could take 2 or 3 weeks more.

i think that 10 goldfish would be too dirty to keep in the tank, for a few weeks, as they are messy buggers....

That's why you should leave only a couple, they will provide enough amonia to cycle the tank.

what temp should i set the tank to after i remove the goldfish today? also should the water in the tank be a little cloudy in normal operation..

Don't remove the goldfish... leave a couple of them for another 3 weeks or until Ammonia an Nitrates are 0, once this is complete and you remove the goldfish the ideal temp of a tropical tank is around 26*C

lso re filter changing, do i need to do this even with an empty tank?(no fish)

Do not change the filters in the tank until the cycle is completed!

Regards
Pablo

ok an update.. my tank was installed new on 4th nov running two weeks now... ( jeuwel 180 vision) had a few goldfish in from the start, to get the ball rolling.
tank at a constant 26c with a thermometer at either end of tank.
on 16th nov i added

2 scissor tails
2 red blue columbians
2 buenos aires tetras
2 red eyes
2 silver tips

all doing well.

then on sat i added 6 neon tetras , (blue and red)
all are doing well.. i did a ph test and it was on the second higest blue mark on the scale.

in terms of water changes, should i do a 25% change at 4wks?
anything else i should watch out for?

in the filter , i have black carbon activiated sponge, and a green jeuwel
one, i think a nitrite remover, ? as well as the other sponges

i would prefer to do water changes at 2wk intervals, smaller changes
but with the new tank not sure what to do..
also is it possible to get an ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate tester in one digital device with lcd readout?

You've added a lot of fish very quickly which isn't a good idea. Did your tank cycle, i.e. were ammonia and nitrITE at 0? Have you tested them recently since adding the fish?

Please do this as soon as you can as you could loose fish very quickly through ammonia/nitrite poisoning. Even if these are 0, You should not add any more fish for at least a month to let your tank mature.

In terms of water changes, 10% weekly is generally recommended. Did you do a 50% change before you added the fish. You were doing a fishless cycle if I recall.

I'm not aware of digital device to test all levels. I recommend the API test kit. There are also others available. You need one urgently!!

i originally started off the tank with 10 goldfish... on 4 nov.
after about 2 days i removed 8 and brought them back to the shop. the the 2 remaining goldfish were removed and on 16th i added the 10 tropical fish temp was constant at 26c before adding them.

then on 18th added the neon tetras.

i didnt change any water at all. i did an ammonia test last night and it was on the rise, it was on the 2nd lowest green point on the list.

ill do a test for ammonia again today, and see what it reads..
and a nittrite one also
would it be a good idea to change some water today?
also is there anywhere in the swords area where i can get stress coat?

Your tank has obviously not cycled. You seemed to be doing well with the fishless cycle - what happened?? Why did you choose to add more fish before it was finished?? Did you read the information on cycling at the links I gave you earlier in this thread?? You should not have added any fish until your readings for ammonia and nitrITE were 0.

You need to do an URGENT water change as you are poisoning your fish. I'd recommend 50% today and 20 to 30% every day until your ammonia and nitrITE readings are 0. Make sure you use a dechlorinator like Stress Coat and bring the water up to the same temperature as the tank before adding.

There is a pet shop in Swords (it's not great, but they will have Stress Coat). I don't know how well you know Swords, but it's on the small street that runs parallel to the main street (behind McDonalds). You can get to it from the main street if you walk through the pedrestrian way down the side of McDonalds. It's opposite Indie Spice (the Indian Restaurant) and beside the underground car park.

ok ill change 50% water tonite, is it ok to leave the tank 1/2 empty as i warm the water?

i have a 35 L container which i will fill from tap and leave beside a radiator to warm before adding to tank


how do you guys warm the water before changing?

cheers

how do you guys warm the water before changing?

Just use hot water from the kettle to bring the temperature up. It would take forever to warm the water next to a radiator.

It's ok to leave the tank half empty when you prepare the water.

You said you had 2 heaters I think.
If so you can heat the water with one of these turned up full blast and it should heat the water in about an hour.
Make sure to turn it back down to the previous setting before putting it back in the tank.
If you can't make it to Swords the Pet Centre in Drogheda will have test kits for Ammonia,Nitrite and pH.

Best of luck and be patient.
Processor.

Sorry just saw Ken's post and the kettle would be quicker.

Processor.

50% of tank water changed, 90ltrs , and the temp of tank stayed constant during change,

do you think i should change 20% of water in 2 days?

You should get yourself the test kit and do your Ammonia and Nitite tests and if they are up - more than likely they are - you should do a change.

If it's a thing that you are busy commuting to and from work as most of the population in Louth and Meath these days then I can get a test kit for you in Drogheda and drop it out to you. I'll be in the area today and Thursday.
It is important, no essential that you do your tests.

Processor.

thanks for the offer,
i have the kits, will test this evening.
the last test i did before changing the water the ammonia was at the second lowest level i think .50mg or ppm and nitrates was at the lowest level.

can you get electronic devices to test ammonia, nitrites and nitrates?

Not all in one as far as I know. Would be dead handy though.. I'd love one but if you are super lazy you can get the Tetratest test strips which have 5 different tests on them. Bit pricey at about €1 per test (€20 for a pack of 20 test strips) but then it doesn't take forever to do it the pipette and test tube way.

Processor.

PS. Anyone know where I could get a spare pipette and a few more test tubes. Can't I say I've passed too many 'Pipette' shops recently. Would a chemist have them ?

Chop the tetra test strips in half, now its 50c per test.

The readings are exactly the same.

PS. Anyone know where I could get a spare pipette and a few more test tubes. Can't I say I've passed too many 'Pipette' shops recently. Would a chemist have them ?

They had a box of the API test tubes out in the pet shop at the Orchard Garden Centre in Clonsilla (just past Weston Airport as you're heading for Clonsilla village).

I can't remember how much they were charging for them, but I'd doubt if they were too expensive.

i have the kits, will test this evening.
the last test i did before changing the water the ammonia was at the second lowest level i think .50mg or ppm and nitrates was at the lowest level.

Bradan,

Let us know your readings. That will determine how much water you'll have to change and how often. You're primarily concerned with ammonia and nitrITE. Don't worry about nitrATE for the moment.

for testing aquarium water
you can get the electronic hannah device C203 that has an lcd readout
that measures

Ammonia HR 0.00 to 9.99 mg/L Nessler HI 93715-01
Ammonia LR 0.00 to 3.00 mg/L Nessler HI 93700-01
Free Chlorine 0.00 to 2.50 mg/L DPD HI 93701-01
Total Chlorine 0.00 to 3.50 mg/L DPD HI 93711-01
Copper HR 0.00 to 5.00 mg/L Bicinchoninate HI 93702-01
Copper LR 0 to 990 µg/L Bicinchoninate HI 93747-01
Nitrate 0.0 to 30.0 mg/L Cadmium Reduction HI 93728-01
Nitrite HR 0 to 150 mg/L Ferrous Sulfate HI 93708-01
Nitrite LR 0.00 to 0.35 mg/L Diazotization HI 93707-01
Dissolved Oxygen 0.0 to 10.0 mg/L Winkler HI 93732-01
pH 5.9 to 8.5 pH Phenol Red HI 93710-01
Phosphate HR 0.0 to 30.0 mg/L Amino Acid HI 93717-01
Phosphate LR

you can buy this online for 482 dollars from usa, and the reagents are about 37 dollars each, depends on what tests you want to do choose from the list above.

a handy way of doing testing, no more colour comparisons! and a more accurate test,.. their website is :

www.hannainst.com or www.hannainst.co.uk

also there is a tester available that you leave the probe permanently in the tank and it connects to your pc, and you can track and monitor all the above tests using software on your pc, useful for recording accurate trends and history of your tank water quailty.

also you can have the water quality maintained automatically, by this device.

ok test completed here are the results


nitrite 0 ppm

ammonia 0.25 ppm /mg/l

ok test completed here are the results


nitrite 0 ppm

ammonia 0.25 ppm /mg/l

Ok, that doesn't look too bad. Did you test for NitrITE before? I'm not sure whether that part of the cycle is complete or hasn't started yet. If you saw nitrITE previously, then it should be complete.

I would recommend a 20% water change tonight to bring the level of ammonia down. It's very toxic to the fish. You will need to do this daily change until ammonia is zero.

It's difficult cycling with this many fish, but it is possible once you are rigorous with your testing and water changes.

hi there, saw a little nitrite before but it was low. on closer examination of the nitrite level it was between 0ppm and 25 ppm today, not exactly 0 but not quite 25.


. how ,long do you think it should take for the ammonia to reach zero?


the petshop :roll: :roll: told me i could add fish after a week... but i waited a little longer.... :shock:

ok will change 20% tonight, which is about 36L....
or i could use ammo lock? to make the ammonia non toxic? or is that not a good idea..

I wouldn't recommend ammo lock as it may hinder the cycling process.

Hopefully you should see both go to zero within a week.

Good luck!

20% of water changed this evening.

changed 20% of water last night , discovered one dead fish at the bottom of the tank this morning.