Retirement and forum shutdown (17 Jan 2022)

Hi,

John Howell who has managed the forum for years is getting on and wishes to retire from the role of managing it.
Over the years, he has managed the forum through good days and bad days and he has always been fair.
He has managed to bring his passion for fish keeping to the forum and keep it going for so long.

I wish to thank John for his hard work in keeping the forum going.

With John wishing to "retire" from the role of managing the forum and the forum receiving very little traffic, I think we must agree that forum has come to a natural conclusion and it's time to put it to rest.

I am proposing that the forum be made read-only from March 2022 onwards and that no new users or content be created. The website is still registered for several more years, so the content will still be accessible but no new topics or replies will be allowed.

If there is interest from the ITFS or other fish keeping clubs, we may redirect traffic to them or to a Facebook group but will not actively manage it.

I'd like to thank everyone over the years who helped with forum, posted a reply, started a new topic, ask a question and helped a newbie in fish keeping. And thank you to the sponsors who helped us along the away. Hopefully it made the hobby stronger.

I'd especially like to thank John Howell and Valerie Rousseau for all of their contributions, without them the forum would have never been has successful.

Thank you
Darragh Sherwin

Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

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dazzler (darren tierney)
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12 Feb 2008 14:55 #1 by dazzler (darren tierney)

Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day was created by dazzler (darren tierney)

Hi everyone, new to Tropical fish keeping and have a bit of a problem at the moment.

Got my Aqualantis 90L fish tank just before christmas and cycled the tank for about 4 weeks. All water readings were fine.

I then added 2 platys, 1 sword tail, 1 molly and 1 dwarf Gourami.

Again tested the water and all fine.

2 weeks later I added 6 guppies.

Again tested the water and all fine.

3 weeks later (last week) I added 3 zebra danios, 6 neon tetras and 1 Chinese algae eater.

Again tested the water and all fine.

Water tests have always been at:
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10/20
PH - 7.8-8.2

However since last Monday I have lost a fish a day. So far lost 4 Neon tetras, 1 Molly and 2 Zebra Danios.

There is no sign of any disease but I have observed unusual activity in 1 of the fish before he died. He seemed to drift in and out of consciousness and float around the tank. While at the bottom his mouth was opening and closing rapidly.

Any suggestions.

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mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)
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12 Feb 2008 15:09 #2 by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)

Replied by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Water change about 25% straight away!!!!!!!!

and could you test water please and post results
Mickey

Mickey Wallace & Cath Woods

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nonie (leonie troy)
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12 Feb 2008 15:16 #3 by nonie (leonie troy)

Replied by nonie (leonie troy) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Hi Dazzler, Sorry to hear about your loss. It seems to me the 6 out of the last 10 fish added to the tank have died. In my opinion this may have been the problem. Have you done any water changes or used any medications? I bought fish in the last two weeks and 3 of them have died over the last week. It seems that some of the fish are of poor quality lately due to bad water supply and peoples views/worries on this have been viewed on the forum over the last few weeks. Do you have an air pump, heater and filter in the tank - wats the specs? Have any of the fish that died look different in shape or color? The Ph level you stated is this changing as it shouldn't change too dramatically only by 0.3 at a time as it causes stress to the fish. I hope this might help a bit!

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Didihno (Didihno)
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13 Feb 2008 09:48 #4 by Didihno (Didihno)

Replied by Didihno (Didihno) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

It must be said that you are also pushing it in fish stock.
Thats a lot of fish for a 90l tank.

Test the water, then change 25-50%, test again.

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Valerie (Valerie)
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13 Feb 2008 10:01 #5 by Valerie (Valerie)

Replied by Valerie (Valerie) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Hi Dazzler,

I think the rule of thumb for community fish is 1cm of fish per litre of water.

Kindest regards,
Valerie

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Cardnim (Andrew Hanley)
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13 Feb 2008 11:29 #6 by Cardnim (Andrew Hanley)

Replied by Cardnim (Andrew Hanley) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Do you know what filter you have?

Defiantely get us your water readings - Ammonia, Nitrite & Nitrate especially.

I totally agree with Didhino and Valerie though - thats too many fish for a small tank.

Dont panic, with good care, you should be able to save the rest.
Get those water readings, and do those water changes!!

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dazzler (darren tierney)
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13 Feb 2008 15:11 #7 by dazzler (darren tierney)

Replied by dazzler (darren tierney) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

okay very confused now.

I was doing a lot of research on how many fish I can have in a 90 litre tank and everywhere I looked recommended 20-25 would fit comfortably. Obviously no big fish included only guppies, tetras, platys etc.

Indeed 2 local fish shops confirmed this.

So can anyone enlighten me, how many fish can I safely have?

Thanks,

Darren

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Cardnim (Andrew Hanley)
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13 Feb 2008 15:24 #8 by Cardnim (Andrew Hanley)

Replied by Cardnim (Andrew Hanley) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Dazzler,

No good information will ever say the number of fish, because fish are completely different sizes. When you say \"everywhere I looked recommended 20-25 would compfortably fit\" that is worrying because how on earth can they say that - even the fish you list are quite different i.e. guppies are much smaller than platys and Platys poop all over the place so could have much fewer platy than guppies.

Valerie is right with what she said - 1cm per litre (or 1\" per gallon would be the recommended value by all professionals).

Your tank is 90L (does this take into account the water you displace by having substrate and other ornaments/equipment inthe tank? You lose a good few litres through that; but lets take 90L as our value for now)

90L = 20 gallons

so you can have 20 inches of fish

please remember that this is when they are FULLY grown. eg. take a guppy as 2 inches etc.

Yes you can increase this SLOWLY to a maximum of 3\" per gallon, but for a first tank I wouldnt recommend it.

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dazzler (darren tierney)
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13 Feb 2008 15:50 #9 by dazzler (darren tierney)

Replied by dazzler (darren tierney) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Great advice, thanks.

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Peter OB (Peter O'Brien)
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13 Feb 2008 15:57 #10 by Peter OB (Peter O'Brien)

Replied by Peter OB (Peter O'Brien) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

I reckon that your stocking levels would be fine if the tank has up and running for say 6 months but at the moment the filter cannot cope.

Smoke me a Kipper, I’ll be back for breakfast.

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mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)
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13 Feb 2008 16:04 #11 by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)

Replied by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Hi Darren,
Yes i have seen these things that tell you stock density these are only guide lines! and should be seen as that! There are a lot of variables involved that at the moment you do not need to worry about! lets just take this slowly.

Your tank is almost cycled, but it is not yet mature this takes more time! at the moment you have a young colony of good bacteria this needs to develop more and spread through out your tank. At the moment this is not the case. the amount of fish is literally over feeding the bacteria and it cant cope. thus your fish suffer. you can help this by regular water changes and check your parameters. This will give the bacteria time to build up.

always treat your water and you may find stress zyne(forgive spelling) will help also!
Just keep up with water changes for now! you will see the benefits!

But keep us informed and you will get plenty of good advice on here!!!

Mickey

Mickey Wallace & Cath Woods

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Coler (Coler)
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13 Feb 2008 17:42 #12 by Coler (Coler)

Replied by Coler (Coler) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Few questions - answers might help get you more advise.

you're getting test results of 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 10/20 Nitrate - what test kit do you use ?

what filtration are you running ? do you have anything to agitate the surface of the water ?

your Ph shouldn't be swinging that much, especially as you don't seem to have been doing water changes - what's the Ph out of the tap as a matter of interest.

Generally you need to be doing weekly changes of 25% minimum with a proper water conditioner that dechlorinates and treats for heavy metals - get them onto this schedule for a start. Next, make sure your test kit is a good one and in date (liquid drop is best, paper strips useless). Observe the tank very closely for any signs of disease/parasites. I

f your test kits are accurate, you're doing the water changes, you're using a good conditioner and the filtration/oxygenation is adequate the environment shouldn't be killing the fish - must be something else.

p.s what temp is the tank at ?

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dazzler (darren tierney)
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14 Feb 2008 00:29 #13 by dazzler (darren tierney)

Replied by dazzler (darren tierney) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

ok, just tested everything again this evening.

Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10
PH - 7.5
Temp - 82F

No more fish have died so heres hoping....

I use the Nutrafin water test kits.

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mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)
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14 Feb 2008 01:54 #14 by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods)

Replied by mickeywallace (Michael Wallace Cath Woods) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Hi Darren,
I am just looking at your latest readings looking good do i would be starting to have concerns about your PH do like a lot of people i am have difficulty with it too at moment.

could i i suggest you get it checked by your local fish shop(LFS).

my other concern would be the temp 28/82 to my thinking is slightly high.
I dont know much about those algae eaters (aka nothing) so i would hope some one else will correct me if i am wrong. I would consider that to high i would be more comfortable with 25/26 or 77/79. if you are reducing the temp i would suggest about one degree every 24 hours

The reason for this is that the hotter the water is, reduces the amount of dissolved oxygen it can hold.

Keep up with your water changes and doing the tests and it won't be long to you will be sitting back relaxing and enjoying your tank!

Mickey

Mickey Wallace & Cath Woods

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Coler (Coler)
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14 Feb 2008 18:34 #15 by Coler (Coler)

Replied by Coler (Coler) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

I agree with Mickey there - that's a warm tank and may be you could do with lowering temp, and also encouraging some surface agitation (it increases surface area available for gaseous exchange hence increasing oxygen levels) just direct your filter outlet to ripple the surface.

water results do indeed look fine and its great that you havn't lost another. good luck with them.

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sheag35 (Seamus Gillespie)
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14 Feb 2008 20:35 #16 by sheag35 (Seamus Gillespie)

Replied by sheag35 (Seamus Gillespie) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

I would tend to agree with all the information you have recieved here on stocking, water changes, keeping the surface water agitated for O2 exchange and regular tesing of ph. etc, but to me the most likely cause has been the fact that your bioload in the filter was not mature enough to cope with a large number of fish added at the last purchase, which would definately spike your readings lower the available oxygen in the tank and with your tempreature that high you unfortunately lost fish, i hope you now have it lowered and i would go so far as to have it at a max. of 78 degrees for the types of fish you have in the aquarium, generally its only discus and a few other species who can stand 78 - 82 degrees for a long period also at this heat level the beneficial bacteria in your aquarium cannot compete with the fish for the oxygen needed by them to do their work... hope all goes well for you, good to see people joining in this wonderful hobby of ours;)

Fishkeeping the Only way to get wet and wild

currently 25 tanks, and breeding is the aim of everything i keep
location:Limerick

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Sean (Fr. Jack)
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17 Feb 2008 17:20 - 17 Feb 2008 18:21 #17 by Sean (Fr. Jack)

Replied by Sean (Fr. Jack) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

dazzler wrote:

I then added 2 platys, 1 sword tail, 1 molly and 1 dwarf Gourami.

No morts after 7 days, alkaline loving fish
Again tested the water and all fine.

2 weeks later I added 6 guppies.
3 weeks no morts alkaline loving fish platies,swordtail and Guam now quarantined.Again tested the water and all fine.

3 weeks later (last week) I added 3 zebra danios, 6 neon tetras and 1 Chinese algae eater.
5 weeks all previous fish still alive incuding the doomed gourami, acid loving neon are added.Again tested the water and all fine.

Water tests have always been at:
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10/20
PH - 7.8-8.2

However since last Monday I have lost a fish a day. So far lost 4 Neon tetras, 1 Molly and 2 Zebra Danios.
& weeks approx 66% of the neon's are dead to they are the source of the disease (probably the other 2 are deed now (neons???)and 2 out of the 3 (66%) danios other possible source of infection.(non demanding of water parameters) Also a 6 week quarantined molly dies form the infection borough in from the neons/danios

There is no sign of any disease but I have observed unusual activity in 1 of the fish before he died. He seemed to drift in and out of consciousness and float around the tank. While at the bottom his mouth was opening and closing rapidly.

Any suggestions.

Hi not all protozoa are as obvious as white spot, there is a hole array of protozoa and fungi and can all be killed with the same common drugs that are in the commercial available sera cosapur (malachite green a formalin)
I don't think you fish died of over stocking, most probably a disease that you cannot see, for example gill fluke...mouth opening and closing rapidly.

Each time you add new fish treat at 50% of the recommended dose of coaapur for one week, regardless if you can see disease or not, and you would save your self a lot of problems, African cichlids are are lot lesse likely to get disease and like like pH 8.3, although with your small tank, there is only a handful of Tanganyika lake fish that do not grow large e.g lepui etc , I not sure neon's could even live comfortable in that water parameters even if they came into your tank without disease,

That would be a ecumenical matter!!!

Last edit: 17 Feb 2008 18:21 by Sean (Fr. Jack). Reason: spelling

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dazzler (darren tierney)
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29 Feb 2008 21:20 #18 by dazzler (darren tierney)

Replied by dazzler (darren tierney) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Over 2 weeks now and everything ok BUT:

Bad news. As I look now one of the Blue Rams has begun to look quite sickly. His eyes are clouded over, fins look very frayed and generally has lost the usual shine. He is close to the top of the tank with very rapid gill movement.

This little fish won't last long I'm sure of it.

All the water tests are fine.

Please help, what can I do.

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Sean (Fr. Jack)
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01 Mar 2008 18:03 #19 by Sean (Fr. Jack)

Replied by Sean (Fr. Jack) on topic Re:Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day

Thats bacterial, you dont say when you introduced them and whats still alive/doing well, if you have now fully stocked the tanks and been with out morts for over 2 weeks, I would get rid of the rams before the pass it on to the hardy species, rams are hard to keep, its hard to get a clean source of them, its the same with cholalate gouramis.

That would be a ecumenical matter!!!

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Retirement and forum shutdown (17 Jan 2022)

Urgent help Please - 1 fish dying every day