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Retirement and forum shutdown (17 Jan 2022)

Hi,

John Howell who has managed the forum for years is getting on and wishes to retire from the role of managing it.
Over the years, he has managed the forum through good days and bad days and he has always been fair.
He has managed to bring his passion for fish keeping to the forum and keep it going for so long.

I wish to thank John for his hard work in keeping the forum going.

With John wishing to "retire" from the role of managing the forum and the forum receiving very little traffic, I think we must agree that forum has come to a natural conclusion and it's time to put it to rest.

I am proposing that the forum be made read-only from March 2022 onwards and that no new users or content be created. The website is still registered for several more years, so the content will still be accessible but no new topics or replies will be allowed.

If there is interest from the ITFS or other fish keeping clubs, we may redirect traffic to them or to a Facebook group but will not actively manage it.

I'd like to thank everyone over the years who helped with forum, posted a reply, started a new topic, ask a question and helped a newbie in fish keeping. And thank you to the sponsors who helped us along the away. Hopefully it made the hobby stronger.

I'd especially like to thank John Howell and Valerie Rousseau for all of their contributions, without them the forum would have never been has successful.

Thank you
Darragh Sherwin

plant substrate info NEED HELP LIKE ALWAYS :L

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08 Jan 2012 21:47 - 08 Jan 2012 21:49 #1 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
ok lads this is a tricky one i am gettin a new 5 foot clearseal and i will be usen the oliver knott from my 180 so that was 2 10L bags it was enough for the 180 but wouldnt be for the 5 foot

as it would be crazy money to fill it all off oliver knott

i need to come up with something else i was thinkin off a few 25L bags off jbl manado as they are about 20 or so for a 25L

and i wouldnt have much to spend on it

although i do love the look off the oliver knott wat can i do wat is not to price but is good to

would the oliver knott be ok on the bottom and then but the jbl manado over it???

this is doing my head in :L:L so if anyone can help it would be great

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving
Last edit: 08 Jan 2012 21:49 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe).

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08 Jan 2012 21:55 #2 by skk123 (shaun)
I mixed the manado with Oliver not on my 260, i think it looks good I will take a photo later for ya

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08 Jan 2012 21:56 #3 by ghart (Greg Hart)
Sean,
I have also ordered a custom 5' Clearseal tank but I only intend putting plant substrate in the first six inches from the back and down the sides where I intend to put plants. Kooking at using ADA New Amazonia substrate which is not cheap. For the remainder space I will put in inert gravel so I can continue to Gravel siphon to keep the tank in good condition. Any plants in that area will be growing on bogwood.

Greg.

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08 Jan 2012 22:44 #4 by BillG (Bill Gray)
Hi Sean,

Setting up a 200L planted myself at present and have been doing a lot of research on the substrate side of things. I plan to use a mix of Oliver Knott, JBL ProFlora and Akadama Bonsai Soil :ohmy: Based on extensive research, the Akadama will provide all the nutrients, will not alter water chemistry and is fish safe too :)
It is a Japanese volcanic soil which is sintered to remove all organic material, so it is putely nutrients required by plants. It is packed in 14L bags and is primarily spherical about 3 to 4mm in diameter. ITs a dull brown in the bag but almost brick red when wet. I plan to top this mix with Manado along the 2 sides and back of the tank. THe Manado is not a plant substrate as such but it does act as a reservoir for nutrients, absorbing excess nutrients from fish waste etc and releasing them to the plants as required.
I plan to have black volcanic sand in the centre at the back 2/3 of the tank and the whole front will be white silica sand, main planting at back and sides with some foreground planting and lots of mosses on wood and rock in the centre.
The Akadama is anything up to €35 for a 14L bag but I know where you can get it for €14 at present.
PM me if you want the details.

Cheers,

BillG

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08 Jan 2012 22:59 #5 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
i dont like gravel and sand in a tank anymore the more i think about it i really dont want to mix the oliver knott as it is workin wonders for me so im going to see how much i would need in Liters as to fill the bottom off the 5 foot and see wat i can get the oliver knott

mixing gravels can be a night mare in the long run i think let me know how yas get on

thanks

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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09 Jan 2012 12:43 #6 by omen (Conor)
I've used Akadama in all my tanks for about 3 years now. Great stuff! However, when I set up a new tank in the future, I will be using tesco low dust cat litter. It is a hard baked clay also, so seems to be much the same as Akadama, but is dirt cheap!(excuse the pun) As far as I can see it just needs washed really well, over a few days I reckon, and its good to go!

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09 Jan 2012 19:46 #7 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
never heard off anyone usen cat litter keep us posted how u get on with it

wantin to here back from someone about the oliver knotts looks like ill be fillin the five foor with it


sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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09 Jan 2012 22:12 #8 by davey_c (dave clarke)
i've heard cat litter isn't bad at all... sean tbh mixing the substrate won't make it less effective but will spread around the neutrients, as said the manado is porus and will also soak up the neutrients given from the oliver knott and feed it to the plants. this would give all plants that extra boost evenly and not just the ones planted directly in the o/k substrate if it was seperate :)

what dept are ye looking for?

Below tank is for sale

my plywood tank build.

www.irishfishkeepers.com/index.php/forum...k-build-diary#137768

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09 Jan 2012 23:36 #9 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
yeah i was thinkin that meself but i was thinkin off puttin say the manado down and then a layer off the 20L off oliver knott i already have on top so it will look like all oliver knott just i will need about another 25 to 30L off substrate im thinkin 50L would be enough but again im not to sure as never had a 500L befor haha

wat do u think your self mate would love to have it all oliver knott but it is just going to be to pricey as in if i needed another 30L it would be about 150euro just on that so the would have being 250 on just substrate

would love to here from someone to just how much i would actually need in it and wat is the best depth

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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09 Jan 2012 23:49 #10 by AquaticGardenDan (Daniel Madziag)
Sean I was explainig somethink about Manado and Other substrates like O.Knott in that post :
www.irishfishkeepers.com/index.php/fforu...rate-question#113627

If You want to use Manado and O'Knott use it in other way, substrate on the bottom to feed tha roots and Manado gravel on the top. The way You sad You can put even Play send witch wil be probably cheeper than Manado and have same effect.


Dan.

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09 Jan 2012 23:59 #11 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
yeah dan was readin that a few days ago have being watchin it closely thats wat has me in two minds about Manado but then again have seen setups with great growth with the Manado

y doesnt someone just do the oliver knott at about 15 to 20 for a 10L bag hahahahahaha

i am not a fan off sand mate had it in the 260 and i will never use it again it is a pain in the hole

i know wat u are sayin about the Manado on top but they only thing is i like the look off Oknott

if only this was a perfect worls and everything works out as in my head :L

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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10 Jan 2012 00:32 #12 by davey_c (dave clarke)
i don't think sand looks great in a planted tank but i agree with manado over o/k... i have a tanks with manado only in it and i have great healthy growth without any ferts, growth is just slower, so it does its thing its way for growing plants but thats how i like it... i would actualy prefer the look of manado over o/k but each to their own as they say ;)

how long were you using the oliver knott in the other tank? are you going to supliment the ferts back into it if your not planning any more? were you using any capsules or anything when you used it? all this should be considered to deciding if you'll need to get more... its not just a matter of reusing it because the goodness within it could be prity low by now and could need replenishing if you get me.

Below tank is for sale

my plywood tank build.

www.irishfishkeepers.com/index.php/forum...k-build-diary#137768

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10 Jan 2012 00:48 #13 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
it is only about 3 month in the other tank so would say it would be ok just to move to the new tank??

wasnt usen anything as was advised not to that is had everything in it and with the growth rate at the mo is sure doesnt seem like it has lost all its good ness everything from the 180 is gettin moved over to the clearseal think ill have to bite the bullet and just go for the manado over it it is going to kill me to do it tho ha

any iead how much i would need to fill the tank?

wat depth is best

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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10 Jan 2012 09:41 - 10 Jan 2012 10:12 #14 by BillG (Bill Gray)
Hi Sean,

to determine the amount of Manado you need is quite easy :) here are some handy formulas.

If you plan to have the substrate layer the same depth over the whole tank base use this one.

Substrate volume = (S x W x L) / 1000

S - Substrate depth in cm
W - Tank width in cm
L - Tank Length in cm


If you plan to have the substrate slope front to back, then it’s the same but you need to calculate S

This time S = (F + B ) / 2

F - Substrate depth at the front of the tank in cm
B - Substrate depth at the back of the tank in cm

Once you calculate the total volume required, just deduct the volume of Oliver Knott you have.
Last edit: 10 Jan 2012 10:12 by BillG (Bill Gray).

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10 Jan 2012 10:31 - 10 Jan 2012 10:48 #15 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
thanks mate i just have to find the dimensions off the tank now :L:L

just after gettin 2 more 10L bag off Oknott at a great price so hopeing 40L would be enough for the whole tank

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving
Last edit: 10 Jan 2012 10:48 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe).

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11 Jan 2012 00:45 #16 by BillG (Bill Gray)
Happy days, should not be too far off with 40L of the substrate. If you still need to add more volume, you could always put some Manado under it, will still act as a nutrient store, you just wont have to look at it :)

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11 Jan 2012 02:23 #17 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
if worst comes to the worst ill just get a 5th bag haha crazy i know but just dont want to pick it u know

thanks

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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11 Jan 2012 10:56 #18 by ghart (Greg Hart)
BillG,

I was trying to use your formula to work out the amount of substrate for my new tank.

The tank 152 cm length and 38cm width.
I want to have the substrate go from 5cm to 2.5cm from back to front.

I get an answer of 43lbs or 18.5Kg substrate required using the formula .

Is my answer correct?
If not..
Can you do the maths for me and show how the the formula is worked for this.

Greg

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11 Jan 2012 11:11 #19 by smitas5 (Marius Smitas)
Formula should be calculating volume, not kg, as sand vs gravel vs o.Knott weights are so different. O.Knott probably a lot lighter than monado. I have 2*25L bags monado covering more than 5cm over Rio 400 (5ft). I like the look of o.Knott better than monado, just the price :) try not to mix if you can as with light substrate siphoning will do a lot of stirring up and it will be messy I think.

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11 Jan 2012 11:15 #20 by smitas5 (Marius Smitas)
Sorry, my bad, looked at it again at it is calculating volume, not weight.

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11 Jan 2012 12:20 - 11 Jan 2012 12:21 #21 by BillG (Bill Gray)

BillG,

I was trying to use your formula to work out the amount of substrate for my new tank.

The tank 152 cm length and 38cm width.
I want to have the substrate go from 5cm to 2.5cm from back to front.

I get an answer of 43lbs or 18.5Kg substrate required using the formula .

Is my answer correct?
If not..
Can you do the maths for me and show how the the formula is worked for this.

Greg


Hi Greg,

Sorry, was not very clear in my post, the formula is to calculate the substrate volume. There is no way to accurately calculate the substrate weight required as it depends on the density and grain / particle size of the material being used. Most substrates are sold by volume, so makes it easier to calculate this way.

Based on the dimensions you listed, you would need 22 litres of substrate. 21.66 to be exact, but don’t think a third of a litre will make a difference.

Cheers,

Bill
Last edit: 11 Jan 2012 12:21 by BillG (Bill Gray). Reason: fixing a slight omission

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11 Jan 2012 23:10 #22 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
bill any chance u can have a look at the clearseal 5 foot and see around how many Liters i would need for it if u can if not not worries it is the freshwater clearseal 5 foot thanks mate

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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12 Jan 2012 11:45 #23 by BillG (Bill Gray)
Hi Sean,

any idea on the substrate depth you want to go with? and if you want a slope on it?
no problem doing the calculations, but will help not having to do lots for all possible combinations :)

The 5 foot tank is 5 x 2 foot? So approx. 152cm x 61cm, so just need the substrate depth :)

Given that you have 40L of the OK substrate at present, this would give a 4cm level layer over the whole base of the tank, or any of the following combinations of slopes

Front Back
2cm 6cm
2.5cm 5.5cm
3cm 5cm

An extra 10L of the substrate will give you 5.4cm over the whole tank base, or the following with a slope.

Front Back
2cm 8.8cm
2.5cm 8.3cm
3cm 7.8cm
3.5cm 7.3cm
4cm 6.8cm
4.5cm 6.3cm

Cheers,
Bill.

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12 Jan 2012 12:35 #24 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
bill u are a star mate thanks very much yeah im sure 4cm around the whole tank would be ok wat u think?

dont really need the slope ill see when i go to put it in wat way i want to do it

next thing is going to aquastape it that will be a mission and a half lol (not something i am really good at):L:L:L

at least i knoe i have enough :cool: :cool: :cool:

and be thinkin i was good at maths hahahaha

thanks again mate

sean

Sean Crowe

ITFS Member

Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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12 Jan 2012 13:26 #25 by BillG (Bill Gray)
Hi Sean,

think you will be ok with 4cm all over the base unless you plan to use any plants with huge root systems.
Best of luck with the aquascaping :) based on the previous set-up you did, it should look amazing.

Here is an aquascaping design aid I found last year and posted at the time, could be useful.

www.theaquatools.com/aquasketcher


Cheers,

Bill

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12 Jan 2012 14:30 #26 by BlueRam (Sean Crowe)
bill u are a gentleman thank u so much ill have a look at that later on ill try rope a few aquascaping masters from here one day (KEVVVVVVVV) :L:L:L to see if he is willin to take a trip down to navan some day ill just make sure it is on the day i am replanting the new tank hahahahaha

thanks mate

sean

Sean Crowe

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Location: Navan

Always Remember Surviving Is Not Thriving

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12 Jan 2012 22:19 #27 by ger310 (Ger .)

Hi Sean,

think you will be ok with 4cm all over the base unless you plan to use any plants with huge root systems.
Best of luck with the aquascaping :) based on the previous set-up you did, it should look amazing.

Here is an aquascaping design aid I found last year and posted at the time, could be useful.

www.theaquatools.com/aquasketcher


Cheers,

Bill



Jaysus thanks for that link Bill,its the business so it is :)))

Ger

What do you call a three legged Donkey?

A Wonkey....duh ha :)

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